Reality Check - Apple Cyser Recipe

THawk · Mar 31, 2011

Just need a reality check whether what I'm planning is feasible. It's for a 1 gallon batch:

4 pints Motts Apple Juice (pasteurized)
1 quart Distilled Water (balance of 1 gallon)
3.5 lbs Clover Honey
Yeast Nutrient and Energizer

Yeast: Lalvin EC-1118

1-2 Cinnamon sticks
1 whole clove
1 tsp Ground Nutmeg
2 apples

Should I even add the apples? I was hoping to do a 'liquid apple pie' mead for Christmas...

Hard to get cider without paying a fortune where I am. That's why I'm using juice instead. I'm also using the juice as a substitute for some of the water...

Medsen Fey · Mar 31, 2011

This will have a very high starting gravity - probably 1.140-1.150 or more and is going to give you a high-ABV, rocket-fuel cyser that is going to take time to mellow and it is going to blow off a lot of the aromatics. If the fermentation temperature is high, it will be quite harsh.

If you ferment it cool, you'll be better off. I'd consider saving the apples and adding them in the secondary to boost the apple aroma once the yeast have settled down.

moonie · Mar 31, 2011

I have a gallon and a half of Cyser aging right now. I used 1116 and had a starting gravity to give me around 12.5%, finished at 0.990 so I stabilized and backsweetened to 1.010. Looking forward to seeing how it is in another six months or so.

Personally I would go for lower alcohol and backsweeten as it will give you more control over FG and sweetness and with the lower alcohol it will should be fit to drink sooner.

I used only honey, apple juice (with no preservatives except vitamin C) spring water to adjust SG to where I wanted it and a large amount of Cinnamon sticks . 4 per gallon in primary, fresh 4 per gallon in secondary and 4 more fresh per gallon when I racked again once fermentation was complete and I stabilized and backsweetened.

THawk · Mar 31, 2011

Lessons learned tonight:
a. I must not make mead while tired...
b. Not all gallon jars are alike...

Accidentally put 1 TABLEspoon of Fermax into 1 gallon of must. By the time I realized the error I had just dropped the stuff into the jar. Will that do anything untoward? Also I noticed that I seem to have loads of honey on the bottom of the jar. Is it normal for honey to not mix completely with apple juice??

How would I ferment this cool? I live in the tropics... hard to find a cool enough spot to let it ferment... maybe I can just cover it with a towel??

When I rack into the secondary, should I add the cinnamon and clove again?

Medsen Fey · Mar 31, 2011

The overdose of Fermax probably won't be problem, but I certainly wouldn't add any more.

I keep stuff cool by using a spare fridge (with a temperature controller) . If you can't control the temperature, you may want to consider picking another yeast that handles temperature better if you are going to be brewing in the upper 70s F or higher.

mmclean · Mar 31, 2011

THawk said:
How would I ferment this cool? I live in the tropics... hard to find a cool enough spot to let it ferment... maybe I can just cover it with a towel??

You can place your carboy in a pan of water, wrap it in a towel or a tee shirt and place it in front of a fan.

I would also suggest buying yeast with the highest temp range, until you set up a cool room or frig or whatever.

THawk · Mar 31, 2011

Awesome... I'd really hate to have to throw the batch out... I didn't bother adding energizer -- should I still add it?

Doesn't seem like the honey and apple juice combined very well... I've already pitched the yeast, can I still stick a spoon into the must and stir? I guess I should have combined the water and honey first THEN added the apple juice... live and learn...

mmclean · Mar 31, 2011

For the first 1/3 of the fermentation (until the 1/3 sugar break) you can and should add air into the must. Small carboys can be picked up and shaken. Larger carboys can be stirred. This is why some perfer to do primary in an wide mouth container( jar or bucket with a cloth over it), and secondary in a small mouth carboy with an air loick.

THawk · Mar 31, 2011

mmclean said:
Small carboys can be picked up and shaken.

Not this one... It's awfully heavy empty. I just stuck a spoon into it and stirred... It's a one gallon jar that I bought here in the Philippines... The other issue is that the top piece, that comes off, doesn't really form a good enough seal. It's got a spout for an airlock (or in my case, a balloon)... I think I'll use this vessel as a secondary ferment vessel -- since the top peels off that I can easily get fruit and stuff into it...

Medsen Fey · Mar 31, 2011

THawk said:
I didn't bother adding energizer -- should I still add it?

Doesn't seem like the honey and apple juice combined very well... I've already pitched the yeast, can I still stick a spoon into the must and stir?

You can stir, but gently or you'll get a Mead Eruption Accident (MEA).

I wouldn't add any energizer. You've given it enough Fermax to do the job.

THawk · Apr 4, 2011

When I rack to the secondary, would adding another dose of the spices help the flavor?

akueck · Apr 4, 2011

Taste it. If you want more spice, add more. As far as "help the flavor", time is probably the single best thing you can add.

THawk · Apr 4, 2011

Also, when I rack to secondary, I'm going to end up with a lot of head space. If I add a honey-water mixture, will fermentation restart (not that I'm planning it that way)...

akueck · Apr 4, 2011

It might restart. It depends on a few variables, but diluting it and adding sugar will very often result in some renewed fermentation.

If you search for "topping up" you'll find that folks use marbles (aquarium grade only!), corks, whatever to reduce headspace.

THawk · Apr 4, 2011

will the renewed fermentation result in added sweetness (I know ABV will likely go up)? Will it be as violent as the primary?

and how much headspace is acceptable in the secondary? Do I have to fill the jar to the brim (or at least up to where the stopper hits liquid)?

Don't know if I can get aquarium grade marbles here... you'll be amazed what people in the Philippines put in their fish tanks...

akueck · Apr 4, 2011

If the added sugar doesn't ferment all the way out, then yes it will be sweeter. Otherwise you're just making more alcohol. Again, really hard to predict what will happen as all fermentations are different. You're more likely to get residual sugar if you put a lot of honey in than if you added just a little.

How much headspace? "Minimal" is the answer, but I don't know if there is a quantitative answer to that. Traditional meads tend to oxidize more slowly than fruit meads, for example, and some meads seem not to care at all if there are gallons and gallons of headspace.

If you restart fermentation the new CO2 produced should push a lot of oxygen out of the headspace, as long as it isn't a huge amount of air. Viable yeast will also pull oxygen out, so that goes in your favor too.

Chevette Girl · Apr 5, 2011

And you probably don't want to fill your vessel right up to the stopper, if it gets warmer, it might push the liquid up through the stopper and into your airlock (or balloon, as the case may be).

Most carboys have a narrow neck and if you fill to where it's narrow that's about as good as it's going to get.

If you do add some honey or sugar water to top it up with, it will likely ferment again, which as Akueck says will create more CO2 to protect your mead, but I'd be very surprised if further fermentation was very vigorous, I never get more than little bubbles rising to the surface.

THawk · Apr 5, 2011

Chevette Girl said:
And you probably don't want to fill your vessel right up to the stopper, if it gets warmer, it might push the liquid up through the stopper and into your airlock (or balloon, as the case may be).

Most carboys have a narrow neck and if you fill to where it's narrow that's about as good as it's going to get.

If you do add some honey or sugar water to top it up with, it will likely ferment again, which as Akueck says will create more CO2 to protect your mead, but I'd be very surprised if further fermentation was very vigorous, I never get more than little bubbles rising to the surface.

Awesome. That's what I needed to know. I think the gallon jar I bought here in the Philippines holds more than what the vendor said it would...

Primary ferment seems to have died down a bit -- it's still bubbling, but not as violent as before...

akueck · Apr 6, 2011

Chevette Girl said:
And you probably don't want to fill your vessel right up to the stopper, if it gets warmer, it might push the liquid up through the stopper and into your airlock (or balloon, as the case may be).

I racked my chocolate mead to about 1.5" from the top of the carboy. It got 20 degrees warmer this weekend and guess what: mead in airlock. Thermal expansion is not my friend.

THawk · Apr 6, 2011

That reminds me, what *do* you do when the must/mead ends up in the airlock? Can you just leave it there and clean it up when you rack?

Reality Check - Apple Cyser Recipe

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