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MJJ
03-19-2012, 12:17 AM
Joe's Grape Mead / Pyment


I tried this recipe with much success. Thank You Joe.
I have 2 questions.
First, Welch makes a black cherry/concord grape juice.
Will this juice work as well too?
Second,
Can I do this in a 3 gallon batch or does it only work in 1 gallon batches?

Thank You for your time.



(Recipe in question)
2 lbs Clover honey
1 oz buckwheat honey
1/8t Pectin Enzymes (I used but on second thought I probably didn't need since Welch's is already clear)
64-oz Welch's Grape Juice with Vitamin C added- Make sure it has no preservatives in ingredients other than Vitamin C added (Absorbic Acid)
Balance water if you need it to make 1 gallon after adding honey mixed in water (don't use too much water in honey mix or you'll end up with more than you bargained for.
Lalvin EC-1118
Methods/steps
Just finished bottling my first Grape Mead (Melomel) or Pyment whatever one wishes to call it and it was started on November 4th and is simply wonderful to drink already. It was ready in 5 weeks!
Thought I would share my recipe with you, as it is the youngest best tasting, quick mead I have had thus far. Too bad

I only made 1-gallon experimenting.

It will ferment super fast to dry (about 13% alcohol) because of type of yeast and all the nutrients and natural sugars in Welch's grape juice. It should be to SG =1.000 or less in 14- 21 days max.
Rack to clean carboy over mixture of 6-oz honey, 6-oz Welch's grape juice, 1/2t of Sorbate and 1/2 crushed campden tablet.
It will stabilize and clear fast. Let it clear and set for another 2 weeks and it will be ready to bottle and drink.
It will be medium sweet but smooth and drinkable right away. If you want it semi sweet use 4-oz honey instead of 6-oz / gal.
The only reason I used the Campden (Sulphite) is because my understanding is that using both Potassium Sorbate and Sulphite together will definitely inhibit renewed fermentation and it did for me.
I went with the sweeter version to please my wife and can't wait till she gets home to try it.
I got 4 regular bottles and one small bottle and drank the rest. I don't usually like sweet wine but this was the fastest best so far. I'm told that most melomels don't require a lot of aging to be good and if this gets any better with age, I'll probably never buy store bought wine again.
Color is deep red, has nice legs on sides of glass after swirling, good nose and great balanced taste) Just don't tell everybody you used Welch's. I won't. Because the juice is clear to start, clearing is naturally fast, fast, fast.
Enjoy cause I am.
Regards Joe
-- submitted by Joe Mattioli

Chevette Girl
03-19-2012, 01:44 AM
Hey, MJJ, welcome to the forum!

I have not made this recipe myself but I'm pretty sure of two things: 1) scaling it up to 3 gal should not be a problem at all if you keep all the proportions the same (except the yeast), and 2) using the black cherry concord grape juice will probably work just fine BUT it breaks the warranty on Joe's recipe because it was designed and tested based on pure grape juice, the sugars may be a little different... That said, I break the warranty on Joe's Ancient Orange all the time and have come up with some damn good variations (and the odd failure), so at the very worst, if it's not drinkable in 5 weeks, it'll probably be fine in 6 months.

...And I would use the pectic enzyme anyways, grapes do contain pectin and Welch's is almost certainly heat-processed, you won't always be able to see it if there's pectin (I've made perfectly clear jellies that are solidified with pectin).

hepcat
03-19-2012, 08:42 AM
That sounds good! Thanks for sharing recipe.

MJJ
03-19-2012, 09:39 AM
Hey, MJJ, welcome to the forum!

I have not made this recipe myself but I'm pretty sure of two things: 1) scaling it up to 3 gal should not be a problem at all if you keep all the proportions the same (except the yeast), and 2) using the black cherry concord grape juice will probably work just fine BUT it breaks the warranty on Joe's recipe because it was designed and tested based on pure grape juice, the sugars may be a little different... That said, I break the warranty on Joe's Ancient Orange all the time and have come up with some damn good variations (and the odd failure), so at the very worst, if it's not drinkable in 5 weeks, it'll probably be fine in 6 months.

...And I would use the pectic enzyme anyways, grapes do contain pectin and Welch's is almost certainly heat-processed, you won't always be able to see it if there's pectin (I've made perfectly clear jellies that are solidified with pectin).



Thank You.

veritas
03-19-2012, 10:19 AM
MJJ,

+1 All the things chevette said.

I will add that I have scaled the recipe up and of course it works great.

I have a 5 gallon version of this going right now with a different juice myself.

TAKeyser
03-19-2012, 10:22 AM
What's the purpose of the 1 oz of buckwheat honey? Buckwheat has been pretty scarce in these parts lately and I'd hate to mailorder for a whole ounce of the stuff.

veritas
03-19-2012, 11:14 AM
What's the purpose of the 1 oz of buckwheat honey? Buckwheat has been pretty scarce in these parts lately and I'd hate to mailorder for a whole ounce of the stuff.

It has such a strong honey character that comes through in the flavor. Thats my take on it anyways. I know some people like to add some buckwheat honey to almost all their meads.

TAKeyser
03-19-2012, 11:16 AM
It has such a strong honey character that comes through in the flavor. Thats my take on it anyways. I know some people like to add some buckwheat honey to almost all their meads.

at 1/128 of the batch it doesn't seem like it would do much. Guess I can always order an 8oz honey bear of it.

veritas
03-19-2012, 11:22 AM
You wont need to order it I can almost guarantee if you look around at local health food organic shops etc. You will find a bear or small container of it people love it for coughs and antioxidants and what not.

TAKeyser
03-19-2012, 11:25 AM
You wont need to order it I can almost guarantee if you look around at local health food organic shops etc. You will find a bear or small container of it people love it for coughs and antioxidants and what not.

I guess a trip to the health food store is in order. I usually just walk right past their honey rack since the largest container is two pounds.

veritas
03-19-2012, 11:27 AM
I guess a trip to the health food store is in order. I usually just walk right past their honey rack since the largest container is two pounds.


I know exactly what you mean. If you had to you could even hit a pharmacy they have a product called honey don't cough that as far as I know is pure buckwheat honey. I would have to double check that though.

MJJ
03-19-2012, 12:44 PM
MJJ,

+1 All the things chevette said.

I will add that I have scaled the recipe up and of course it works great.

I have a 5 gallon version of this going right now with a different juice myself.


Thank you very much, I appreciate all the advice I can get.

hepcat
03-19-2012, 10:10 PM
Joe's Grape Mead / Pyment


(Recipe in question)
2 lbs Clover honey
1 oz buckwheat honey
64-oz Welch's Grape Juice with Vitamin C added- Make sure it has no preservatives in ingredients other than Vitamin C added (Absorbic Acid)
Balance water if you need it to make 1 gallon after adding honey mixed in water (don't use too much water in honey mix or you'll end up with more than you bargained for.

Rack to clean carboy over mixture of 6-oz honey, 6-oz Welch's grape juice,
Regards Joe
-- submitted by Joe Mattioli

I'm confused about the differences in bold above...can someone explain why you don't just mix the 2lbs honey, 1oz buckwheat honey and 64oz juice all together initally into a carboy??

TAKeyser
03-19-2012, 10:18 PM
I'm confused about the differences in bold above...can someone explain why you don't just mix the 2lbs honey, 1oz buckwheat honey and 64oz juice all together initally into a carboy??

Those ingredients go together into the first carboy, when it has finished fermenting you rack onto the stabilizing agents and the additional honey and grape juice to backsweeten.

Jas53
03-19-2012, 11:32 PM
What's the purpose of the 1 oz of buckwheat honey? Buckwheat has been pretty scarce in these parts lately and I'd hate to mailorder for a whole ounce of the stuff.

Adventures in Homebrewing in Ann Arbor caries it as well as Joe Randazzos fruit markets in metro Detroit area. $3.50 to $4.50/lb.

TAKeyser
03-19-2012, 11:57 PM
Adventures in Homebrewing in Ann Arbor caries it as well as Joe Randazzos fruit markets in metro Detroit area. $3.50 to $4.50/lb.

Never even thought of checking at Randazzo's and I pass the one at 16 and Garfield daily. I did check Nino Salvaggio's (which I love) and surprisingly they didn't have it, but their honey selection is expensive and the largest container they carry is 1 lb.

And I'm not driving to Ann Arbor for an ounce of honey lol.

hepcat
03-20-2012, 09:12 AM
Those ingredients go together into the first carboy, when it has finished fermenting you rack onto the stabilizing agents and the additional honey and grape juice to backsweeten.

Aahh, that makes sense. thanks TAKeyser.

TAKeyser
03-20-2012, 09:23 AM
Aahh, that makes sense. thanks TAKeyser.

Welcome. All I know is I need to rack and bottle some stuff so I can free up a few carboys and buckets because i wanna give this a try.

Smoky Mountain Reign
03-20-2012, 12:44 PM
What's the purpose of the 1 oz of buckwheat honey? Buckwheat has been pretty scarce in these parts lately and I'd hate to mailorder for a whole ounce of the stuff.

http://www.gotmead.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6491

Not sure if the hyperlink will work or not. If it doesn't, this recipe is discussed in detail under General Recipe Discussion Section and search Quick Grape Mead (drinkable in 5 weeks). Post number 54 states:

"Buckwheat is also in there for body rather than just nutrients alone if I remember my conversations with Joe correctly".

TAKeyser
03-20-2012, 12:59 PM
http://www.gotmead.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6491

Not sure if the hyperlink will work or not. If it doesn't, this recipe is discussed in detail under General Recipe Discussion Section and search Quick Grape Mead (drinkable in 5 weeks). Post number 54 states:

"Buckwheat is also in there for body rather than just nutrients alone if I remember my conversations with Joe correctly".

Thanks the link did work. Guess I'll run to the store and get a honey bear worth of buckwheat so I can give this a try.

Smoky Mountain Reign
03-20-2012, 01:15 PM
If you are buying honey the grocery store route, Whole Foods Market is a national grocery store chain in the US. They have an excellent variety of different types of honey compared to most grocery stores.

TAKeyser
03-20-2012, 01:28 PM
If you are buying honey the grocery store route, Whole Foods Market is a national grocery store chain in the US. They have an excellent variety of different types of honey compared to most grocery stores.

I usually buy local honey in bulk and Buckwheat isn't local for Michigan so yeah I have to go the grocery store route. There's a Whole Foods kind of nearby, but someone earlier in the thread (who lives like 10 minutes from me) said a local high-end produce market carries smaller bottles of Buckwheat so I'm giving them a try first. I do hit Whole Foods up for Honey when I'm low on the 5 gallon bucket and they have a nice selection of Raw Michigan Honey.

Jas53
03-20-2012, 04:58 PM
I usually buy local honey in bulk and Buckwheat isn't local for Michigan so yeah I have to go the grocery store route. There's a Whole Foods kind of nearby, but someone earlier in the thread (who lives like 10 minutes from me) said a local high-end produce market carries smaller bottles of Buckwheat so I'm giving them a try first. I do hit Whole Foods up for Honey when I'm low on the 5 gallon bucket and they have a nice selection of Raw Michigan Honey.

Should have mentioned earlier that Randazzos sell buckwheat in 1 lb jars - bottled by Klein & Sons in St Charles, MI.

hepcat
03-20-2012, 09:01 PM
I'm going to try a good farmer's market about 40 miles away next free Saturday morning I have and if don't find it there will also hit up a whole foods market in the same town, Orlando. I hate going to Orlando unless absolutely necessary. This is a good reason.

TAKeyser
03-20-2012, 09:55 PM
Should have mentioned earlier that Randazzos sell buckwheat in 1 lb jars - bottled by Klein & Sons in St Charles, MI.

Thanks Jas53, all the better since I like supporting those in the state.