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Chevette Girl
11-11-2012, 02:46 PM
Thank you to all who serve or have served to protect our nations. Thank you for doing a job I couldn't do. I'm glad someone can. The least I can do is thank you who are left and remember those who are not.



In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

by John McCrae, May 1915 (http://www.greatwar.co.uk/poems/john-mccrae-in-flanders-fields.htm)

Leeham991
11-11-2012, 03:17 PM
We will remember them



http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd220/leeham991/warphotos.jpg

fatbloke
11-11-2012, 03:22 PM
I usually watch the London Rememberance ceremony as they put it on the TV (the main "National" one - lots of other, smaller ceremonies happen as well as you appreciate). Mainly because I did it myself in 93 while serving with the RN.

I never forget "the fallen", but always, at this time of year, I remember those I've listed below, because I worked with all of them. Some were accidents/natural causes, some conflict.


Matthew (Stan) Baldwin - 11/11/91
Dean Marriott - 8/4/92
Michael (Mack) McKenna - 7/6/93
Preston W (Smudge) Smith - 9/10/95
Mark (Beasty) Beeston - 2/4/97
Stephen Atkins - 5/9/97
Carl Meagher - 10/12/98
Carolyn Crumplin - 24/11/02

I'm pretty sure that their respective families remember them, but I like to think that by me remembering them, at least they won't be forgotten in my life time.

I can picture each and every one of them. All good people.

Yet, I suppose, for the rest of us, life must go on......

kudapucat
11-11-2012, 06:10 PM
At the going down of the sun and in the morning,: We will remember them.

Vance G
11-11-2012, 10:50 PM
Brings to mind a balladier who himself died a hero, by name of Stan Rogers. One of his memorable story songs was Macdonnell on the heights. As fine a remembrance song as Scottie Burns Take the high road. Feeling very Scottish tonight, we have always made good mercs. I wasn't. YOu tube that title and listen to the song if you wish to feel melancholy

kudapucat
11-12-2012, 01:06 AM
Very moving.
For a song that always brings a tear to my eye listen to "And the Band Played Waltzing Matilda": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WG48Ftsr3OI
A very Australian song written and sung by an Irishman I think, by the name of Eric Bogle. He wrote it after seeing his first ANZAC Day parade in Australia in the 70's.
The lyrics are truly devastating.

This too is a horrible song: Written about Vietnam "I was only 19" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Urtiyp-G6jY

Vance G
11-12-2012, 11:33 AM
I guess this counterpoint is instructive too. But I refuse to devalue the service of all the fallen by going into a peacenik fugue. Ask the dead of Aushwitz if wars are ever neccessary. It would be a very different world if 300 Spartans and a larger contingent of Thespians had not held a pass long enough that the Greeks could mobilize a defense. We need to be wary of leadership and those Anzac troops were horribly used at Gallipolli, but bringing it around to a pointless cause, really diminishes their sacrifice. Bottom line, it is good that they are remembered.

Chevette Girl
11-12-2012, 11:41 AM
Thanks for the suggestions guys, I didn't quite get into my Remembrance Day mood because we were late for the ceremony on the Hill, missed the cannons and the fly-by ... I knew we should have taken the bus, there's never anywhere to park... and my husband can't run 2 km like I can although I still did better than he did despite wearing cowboy boots... although my excuses are paltry and my complaints are nothing compared to what the men and women who serve and have served have had to face and will continue to face. We made it for the parade of current and past military, and that's the important part. I will gladly put up with some inconveniences to show my thanks and suppport for people who do a job I could never do. I try to remember and respect all year long, not just one day.

War is a terrible waste, but sometimes it has to be that way. If nobody ever attacked, nobody would ever have to defend, but that's never going to be a reality in our world, there's always someone willing to attack someone else for what they consider to be a justified reason.

This (http://youtu.be/qGpwKQo5_Z0)is one of my favourites this time of year...

mrperq
11-13-2012, 11:19 AM
The first war was a pointless war, wich seems ironical since
all wars are kind of pointless, but this one had no reason.
There was nothing to be gained by either sides. Officially
it was about a murder, in reality it was about a few big
overconfident nations comparing their **** with each other,
each willing to destroy the known world for it, and almost
doing so too.

The world payed the price in blood. Seas of blood. Even
after all that bloodshed, we hadn't learned our lessons.
No, we had to show our big fat **** again and force a slave
contract, which the Treaty of Versailles was, on them, planting
the seeds for extremism and yet another world-consuming war.

When you look at the second war isolated from the first, you
are right, there you have a classic example where big man
acting like big cowards failed to act in fear of violated peace,
actually resulted in peace beeing utterly raped, and the
price to be payed raised exponentionally.

In the big context of history however, every war has been a
retribution for a war that happened before. Before WWI came the
French/German war. Before we had the German War. Before we
had the Napolian Wars. Before we had the war of the Quadrupple
Alliance. And all traces back to the division of the Karolingian
Empire in the 800's, and all of its heirs claiming its crown.
Dynasties died or lost their powder, but their greed and hate
lived on.

After WWII, the chain of violence ended. We didn't destroy what
was left of the german people in frustration. Despite what had
happened, we offered them our hand, and started building a future
with a place for everyone. This is the true miracle war has brought
us in the past century.

Don't get me wrong. I do believe we should avoid war whenever we
can, I also believe when all else fails, we should be brave enouph
to take up that sword, and defend innocence with nail and teeth.

The line between hate, greed and justice can be a verry blurry one,
but we must make sure we remain on the right side of it, even if
others cross it, lest we wish the children of our children to pay
for it.


Citing a few men a thousandfold more wise then I am:

'People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both' - Benjamin Franklin
'The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.' - Sun Tsu
'War does not determine who is right - only who is left.' ― Bertrand Russell
'Wars are poor chisels for carving out peaceful tomorrows.'― Martin Luther King Jr.
'It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather, we should thank God that such men lived.' ― George S. Patton Jr.
'No one won the last war, and no one will win the next war.' ― Eleanor Roosevelt
'I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.' - Albert Einstein

All of them are equally true.

TheAlchemist
11-13-2012, 11:29 AM
Ah, y'all know why we have a Mother's Day by now. And if you don't, I'll post a reminder, come Mother's Day.

Vance G
11-13-2012, 01:21 PM
At least you didn't say violence solves nothing. Tell that to the Do Do and the next Carthagenian you see.