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rj_picou
06-21-2013, 09:10 PM
I'm curious as to what purpose the orange serves. is it taste, acidity , nutrient...
i like the idea of an orange flavoring, but not wanting to waste product in the mess.
can i just use the zest and juices instead without harming the final results?
I'm trying to go as natural as possible (no chemicals) so if using a whole orange will help me do this, then so be it! Just curious...not wanting to loose booze in the racking process!!!

mannye
06-21-2013, 09:22 PM
I'm not sure why an orange? I'm assuming you mean for JOAM, which I will be making for the first time on Monday, but it seems to me like and orange has many different things in one... flavoring from the "meat" bittering agents from the rind and aromatics from the oil.

Seems to me that for a beginner, the orange is kind of like an all in one flavoring "kit".

skunkboy
06-21-2013, 09:55 PM
If about Joes Ancient... it gives is some acidity from the juice, nice orange flavor from the zest, and pucker from pith... although the pith can be optional if you want to just juice and zest an orange...

rj_picou
06-21-2013, 11:10 PM
Kinda what i figured with taste...its my first mead and i was concerned about the bitterness from the pith...time will tell i suppose! If its to bitter i'll just back sweeten.
thanks for the input...this brewing stuff is quite addictive!!!!! I'm 7 days into my very first batch and I'm already planning on my next! I can see now why the word PATIENTS appears so often...LOL

mannye
06-21-2013, 11:42 PM
Kinda what i figured with taste...its my first mead and i was concerned about the bitterness from the pith...time will tell i suppose! If its to bitter i'll just back sweeten.
thanks for the input...this brewing stuff is quite addictive!!!!! I'm 7 days into my very first batch and I'm already planning on my next! I can see now why the word PATIENTS appears so often...LOL

Yes indeed. If yo're like me, you'll want to get a gallon of cider going as well so you can have something to drink while you wait for the mead. Of course, you need to also keep making at least a batch a month so in a few years, you'll have plenty of mead to drink all the time!

rj_picou
06-22-2013, 12:15 AM
That's my plan...to make a gal a month (for now). I've been reading on a quicker, drinkable mead using wyeast 3787. So maybe 2 gals per month...lol

fatbloke
06-22-2013, 03:23 AM
That's my plan...to make a gal a month (for now). I've been reading on a quicker, drinkable mead using wyeast 3787. So maybe 2 gals per month...lol
Well with the first bit you asked, I don't know Joe (I believe Oskaar may do) and have no way of knowing whether the recipe was "pot luck" or a very careful, studied development.

Yet it would seem that with some thought and consideration, the orange is "all of the above".

The recipe but with just juice and zest or even segmented flesh and zest would end up too sweet - it'd open the "which yeast is best?" can of worms......

Bread yeast with that amount of fermentable sugars will leave residual sugars. Residual sugars are in turn balanced by the bitterness. The orange also provides some non-sugars nutrition to the yeast.

The shaking mentioned in the recipe is intended to provide enough air/O2 for yeast development.

The flavours from the orange and spices are obvious.

The raisins are also nutrient providers, possibly also to contribute body/mouth feel and balance (theres not enough to contribute flavour).

As for the "no chems" route ? Don't allow yourself to be conned. Some of those used are actually produced naturally, we just use a more refined, higher strength version to achieve a desired result. Sulphites being a prime example.

Plus your other point about "quick" meads ? There's no such thing really, just that some recipes and methods produce an acceptable result if done in a certain way. They often need stabilising with sulphites/sorbate so the newly produced mead can have any base faults masked, often with back sweetening, acid and/or tannin addition. There are a few recipes that are just quicker than "normal". Plus the base faults I allude to would include lacking balance, alcohol hot, etc etc.

I'm not familiar with that wyeast type so can't really comment. The only ones I've bothered to try are the dry and sweet meads. The dry mead is fine, the sweet mead is a finicky PITA. Stuck ferments, not starting,
are among the problems often posted about it. Iv tried it 3 times and all 3 were problematic.

Liquid yeasts may be fine for beers, what with their needing specific properties, whereas with wines and especially meads, direct cloning is much more difficult.......

Hence IMO, they're not worth the money...... good luck with trying though. I'd be more than happy to try a different one if it seems to produce good results.

Don't forget, the cell count in dry yeasts are much higher than the liquid ones which is, I'd guess, why liquid yeasts lend themselves to needing a starter being made......

rj_picou
06-22-2013, 06:34 AM
Thanks again FB...i read that potassium metabisulfites can cause an allergic reaction with folks...don't want to cause any trips to the hospital because of my mead...will do more reserch on the subject...
this site is so helpful!!! I'm looking forward to actually contributing later down the road and just not being one who asks silly questions

Thanks again

fatbloke
06-22-2013, 11:37 AM
Thanks again FB...i read that potassium metabisulfites can cause an allergic reaction with folks...don't want to cause any trips to the hospital because of my mead...will do more reserch on the subject...
this site is so helpful!!! I'm looking forward to actually contributing later down the road and just not being one who asks silly questions

Thanks again
No, it's not usually allergic reactions that are the concern (though possible), the EU insist on booze being labelled to include sulphites as there is the possible asthmatic reaction to the sulphur element.

Your chances of it actually being a problem are small. Sulphites do break down over time, and if you used either a red wine glass that gives a bigger surface area and/or you allowed your brew to "breathe" (maybe even decant it first, if you're likely to be serving it to a room full of allergenics - I'd have thought that those with that kind of allergy would know to ask before consuming anything like a wine/mead as it's well known that sulphites are used in their manufacture/preparation).......

As for asking silly questions ? The only silly question is the one that you don't ask.

We all have to start somewhere and given that we will all have access to different books, or use different search parameters, or even just get back different search results geographically, with the one that gives the best answer, many, many pages down the list that Mr Google provides - and then gets missed due to information overload........

rj_picou
06-22-2013, 03:22 PM
Thanks again...i'll take all the advice i can get! being new to mead, I'm probably over complicating it...start simple and be PATIENT!!!!

Chevette Girl
06-25-2013, 11:50 PM
For the record, I only ever use the fruit (or sometimes the juice) and zest because I get heartburn from the pith in JAO, and having made it both ways, I really don't notice a difference in the taste from leaving it out, enough time and the pith's bitterness fades anyway.

And if you want to avoid causing an (admittedly rare) allergic reaction to sulphites, just make sure you label everything so your test subjects can make informed choices about what they should drink.

It's significantly safer to just indicate that your brew includes sulphites than it is to give out potential bottle bombs.

I generally list all ingredients on my labels just in case someone does have an allergy. But as Fatbloke said, most of the chemicals we use are for good reason, and certain yeasts produce a small amount of sulphites, so even if you don't add any, there could still be some, but anyone that sensitive to sulphites would probably have problems with most wines.