View Full Version : Puzzled by Nutrient

06-28-2017, 02:38 AM
Like many people I’ve read about on here, I live in the UK and am finding it difficult to source yeast nutrient and energizer. Last week in haste I bought this online: ‘Youngs yeast nutrient’ ingredients-Diammonium phosphate Ammonium sulphate. I’m not even sure what this brings to the table and if it’s worth using. I read the ‘NewBee’ guide from start to finish and got the impression I should get hold of some DAP and Fermaid K, and that both should be added just one time at the time of pitching the yeast (Not hugely confident on this?). However, after reading recent forums I soon got the impression that DAP isn’t commonly used anymore and that maybe I should get hold of some Fermaid O and that’s all I need? Before I try to source anything some advice on what I should perhaps go for would be much appreciated! Unfortunately there are no home brew shops anywhere near where I live where I can go for advice.

The recipe I plan to use: 2lb local honey, water to make up 1 gallon, D47 yeast (again bought in haste as I originally wanted to create a dry mead and now I see that’s not likely with this yeast…)

Another off topic and probably quite stupid question, is it possible to achieve a dry mead with a relatively low ABV? How would I go about this if at all possible?

Thank you very much in advance for all advice!

06-28-2017, 04:11 PM
Nothing is stupid!

Yes is is possible to make a low alcohol dry mead, but you will have to guard against oxidation and contamination in the same manner as making beer. One of the things that makes mead a tad more forgiving is the higher ABV. In addition, a short dry mead will most likely have very little body (a watery sort of mouth-feel) but that's been my experience, and I've only made one short mead, so maybe someone with more short meads under their belt can guide you to some tips and tricks that will make it better... carbonation is one I know about.

As far as nutrients, if you know anyone who makes beer or ale, you can ask them to save the trub for you after a ferment, then look up "washing yeast" on youtube, (because that's what I would do...I wouldn't use the trub with all the nasty bits in it) and wash the yeast to get some nice clean yeast, then boil the clean yeast to make "yeast hulls". Dead yeast makes up a lot of what many things that call themselves "yeast nutrient" are. I haven't looked at exactly what makes up Fermaid O (the current favorite nutrient around here...mine too) but I'll bet there's millions of little dead yeast cells in there.

There may be other ways to get yest hulls, but this way you also learn how to wash yeast!

Try to look for "session meads" or "short meads" I took a quick look-see with google, but I think you need to spend a little time searching as the first few hits are all fruity and sweet. But I'm sure a deeper search will yield something close to what you're looking for.

07-02-2017, 11:02 PM
Newbee guide needs to be updated.
There is no longer any place for DAP. Fermaid-K or Fermaid -O and its equivalents are all you need. I believe in Europe you can get fermaid-E which i believe is similar

07-03-2017, 06:28 AM
Hi Fran

Fermaid O is the best nutrient out there now because its 100% organic nitrogen. Then you have mix of organic and inorganic such as Fermaid K/Wyeast nutrient/others and then you have 100% inorganic (DAP, Urea). Try using only Fermaid O or only Fermaid K/wyeast nutrient/other blends to get better ferments. That said as mannye said for low ABV meads with some boiled yeast and even some DAP you can go out fine (i still recommend the other but...)

I've been getting into session meads lately (low ABV meads, also called hydromels, short meads or craft mead), and the problem with them is get them to have flavour and body. Meads usually ferment dry. But this can result in very thin mead and a bit...well... flavourless. That happened to me the first time. Usually people aim to get them carbonated (its easy dont worry) and bottled in beer bottles but can also be made still.
Here are a bunch of dry recipes (with D47 most of them!) that are 7% ABV and seem good http://www.groennfell.com/recipes and you should also read this http://www.groennfell.com/blog/why-so-hot

I've inspired myself on them to make a batch that is currently bottled, and the best one for now its the bochet (that is, caramelized honey). Here is the recipes i used. The mead log will have many others like this im sure so you can use the search tool to find them. I'll update the thread in a few days when i try them and see which one I like the most. http://www.gotmead.com/forum/showthread.php/26746-Small-session-mead-flavour-trial

Also D47 does creat dry wines, no idea why you said that its not likely.
Edit: also as mannye said carbonation helps give some body but also ending a bit over 1.000, that is, having a bit of resiudal sweetness. This does not mean at all sweet mead. My meads ended at 1.001 and 1.002 and did not taste sweet when i bottled them. But definitely better body than my last try that ended slightly under 1.000. Anyway there are different ways to add some body to session meads, but i dont want to make this too long and swarm you with details.

07-03-2017, 06:39 AM
I used to get my nutrients from the U.K so there certainly are sources for good nutrients around. You might have to order online though because they might be far away. I used to buy tronozymol which is supposedly quite similar to fermaid K. HopandGrape.co.uk also sell fermaid K and go ferm. Nowadays I'm buying in bulk from baldinger in switzerland but I wouldn't go that route until you're confident in your technique and start ramping up your production.
You can keep the dap and perhaps use some of it each time you make a high gravity mead. I always have one such mead on hand - it's nice to vary. I think you can use some dap at the beginning of the ferment and later on switch to something really good like fermaid K or O. You might also use some dap if you make wines or high fruit meads. The fruit has plenty of complex nutrients so using some dap doesn't make a huge difference. Using dap in honey makes a big difference because honey is deficient in nutrients and you don't want the majority of yeast's nutrients to be dap.

But caduseus wasn't far off from the truth when he said there isn't any place for dap and other mazers (and even I) could argue that you might as well always use a better nutrient