New Bee First Post

fish · Oct 12, 2007

I am new here I have been brewing beer for about a year and I have had a great time doing it. I just started making ciders and I have a few bubbling away right now. I wanted to try a mead and I was thinking about Joes Ancient Orange. That recipe looks great for a new bee. My question for it is what if instead of water I used apple juice? Will that just lend a cider flavor to it or will it change the composition. I like sweet meads and I like that this is a recipe that a new bee can try after a few weeks and not have to wait for a year to have something nice. I don't want to use juice if it will make the mead drier.

Thanks

wayneb · Oct 12, 2007

Juice in JAO should not make the result drier, since the dryness (or lack of it) is a function of the bread yeast used. You'll top out at an alcohol level somewhere around 9-10%, so anything starting with even more fermentable sugar than the original recipe will finish even sweeter. The key to Joe's early drinkability is the relatively low alcohol, which doesn't stay "hot" for very long -- you're ready to drink in a couple of months.

Now if you were to use a regular wine yeast...

(By that I mean it'll go much drier on you and have a significantly higher ABV with almost any wine or mead yeast, which will then in general take longer to mellow with age.)

Oskaar · Oct 13, 2007

I'm going to give a different perspective than what WayneB gave you.

Adding cider/juice turns this into something other than Joe's Ancient Orange. Cider also will stretch the ABV tolerance of just about every yeast I've ever worked with (including bread yeast). You're also adding more malic acid from the apples that will alter the overall flavor and character of this recipe.

I like Wayne's suggestion of going with a wine yeast, I'll suggest D47 as it is a great yeast for cyser. I'd bump up your gravity to a starting point of about 1.14x. That'll leave you some residual sweetness and a nice kick to boot!

Take a chance . . . Custer did!

Oskaar

wayneb · Oct 13, 2007

Oskaar - I did actually "stretch" the estimated performance of the bread yeast in my assessment of his plans... it isn't normal for Fleishmann's active dry to top out around 10%. :laughing7:

But that said, I agree with you -- a little more honey in the mix will guarantee a sweet finish without the need to backsweeten. But 1.14x, even with D47, is a little high for someone's first batch of mead. Unless they pay attention to nutrient addition schedules, temperature and possibly pH, they might end up stuck higher than they'd like it to finish.

And like you, I'm a champion of D47 for anything with apples in it!

Oskaar · Oct 13, 2007

Heya Wayne,

I think that 1.14x is definitely a high gravity for a newbie, but D47 is a good yeast for this level when cider is in the mix. I base several of my cysers off of this and routinely drop from the initial 1.14x to 1.020 in seven days or less. I honestly don't have to manage it too awful much past the usual aeration and nutrient at the end of the lag phase. Generally it doesn't need the 1/3 sugar break dose. He can always drop the initial gravity to 1.13x and stray to the conservative side.

Cheers,

Oskaar

Oooh, that's 5K for me! LOL

wayneb · Oct 13, 2007

Oskaar said:
Oooh, that's 5K for me! LOL

Keepin' score, are ya?? Well, the best part of it is that you provide quality with the quantity! :icon_thumright:

Oskaar · Oct 14, 2007

Well, the only reason I even noticed is because I was on another board and saw someone with like over 6000 posts and thought "Gee, do they even have a life?" to which I noticed my totaly and thought "Hmmm, maybe gotta walk the dog more!" LOL

Cheers,

Oskaar

fish · Oct 14, 2007

Thank you both for the really good information, I think I will do the straight recipe and then riff from there.

Thanks

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