New Testament has 4 stories about the life of Jesus, no perfect alignment there...many facets.
Origins of life
- Thread starter Medsen Fey
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New Testament has 4 stories about the life of Jesus, no perfect alignment there...many facets.
One of the funniest stories about creation I ever heard was told to me by my religious instructor...
Driver: Yeah, I never understood what took your god so long.(clearly in good fun by the driver, Sikhs consider everyone's god the same god)
;D Man that always made me smile.
Love this.
AToE said:
Interesting, when Jews and Muslims come to the US for Seeds of Peace Camp, or when Northern and Southern Irish emmigrate to New Zealand, they come to realize that they are more like eachother than different in some ways (particularly with respect to food).
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Oh man, let's not get started on the New Testament, the history of that collection of disparate materials is a long sordid and confused one! Remember too that only one of those stories is believed by most historians (Christian and otherwise) to have be dictated by someone who knew Jesus (Gospel of Mark), 2 of the others use Mark itself as a source in combination with the now lost "Q source" and I can't remember what the sources are thought to be for the 4th one.
The problem of all the long lost gospels/books is really saddening. I know at least 1 has been found and is being incorperated by some religious leaders, but so vastly many were lost and we'll never know what they contained. Terrible tragedy, really makes me sad.
...apoptosis - programmed cell death...
Any creature that has hollow viscera (ie circluatory system, airways, intestinal tract etc) practices apoptosis in development. It's a stroke of evolutionary genius.
Ontogeny Recapitualtes Phylogeny.
Any creature that has hollow viscera (ie circluatory system, airways, intestinal tract etc) practices apoptosis in development. It's a stroke of evolutionary genius.
Ontogeny Recapitualtes Phylogeny.
I've never really understood all the fighting between the Abrahamic faiths, I get that everyone wants everyone else to join their religion (except for the Jews, they don't care if you join), but what's with all the killing?
Are all 3 really pretty different? Yes, in some ways Islam is closer to Judaism, in other ways closer to Christianity, and Christianity (being the middle child of the family) obviously has been heavily influenced by Judaism, and in turn have heavily influenced Islam. I just don't get why the anger though.
Just like here in the West we group Hinduism into one religion when really it is hundreds, anyone on the outside studying Judaism Christianity and Islam would write down that Christianity and Islam were reform branches of Judaism (rather radical departures of course, but still share the roots).
But nope, everybody's gotta slaughter everybody.
I think the one I'm thinking of is one of the Gnostic Gospels that was rejected long ago and just now worming it's way back into use.
Truth is Truth even if no one believes it.
A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it.
Truth is absolute and a lie always opposes Truth.
Feelings can and do lie.
Everyone worships something, God, self, science, possessions, nature, power, ideas etc.
A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it.
Truth is absolute and a lie always opposes Truth.
Feelings can and do lie.
Everyone worships something, God, self, science, possessions, nature, power, ideas etc.
The definition of "worship" is key here, if it's the common spoken meaning of the word then no, not everyone does worship something, but if it's the "hold in high esteme" kind of definition then sure, I would imagine everyone falls under that umbrella.
I'd add something to your above post though "untruth" not all that is not true is a lie, a lie is a deliberate untruth.
I never really had a problem with any of this myself. My thought process is as follows.
1) I believe in God as the Bible describes him.
2) I believe he provided the Bible for man's benefit.
3) I believe that, although it was written by men, they were inspired by God.
4) I believe there were many writings either not inspired by God, or not meant to be included in what would come to be the Bible.
5) I believe he therefore was responsible for guiding events to make sure that all of the material he wanted was included in the Bible, accurate copies were (are) available, and that he protected the writings from the many attempts to wipe them all out through history.
6) I believe he has the power to do all of this.
I see evidence of this not just in the fact that the Bible still exsists and is well known today, but also in that, despite being written across many years by many people, it still displays an internal harmony and consistent theme from beginning to end.
I don't think it still existing and being widespread is really evidence that it's true, as the same can be said of scriptures from many different religions.
I agree with the rest of what you said though, if you're believing in the Christian God then there's no reason to believe he couldn't have guided the writing and assembly of the Bible as it exists today.
Of course confusion arises when passages conflict, but one could also imagine that God might have reasons for not making it easy!
EDIT: not so sure about that consistant theme, but that's deep theological fodder, up for endless good natured (and unfortunately non-good natured) debate!
I agree with the rest of what you said though, if you're believing in the Christian God then there's no reason to believe he couldn't have guided the writing and assembly of the Bible as it exists today.
Of course confusion arises when passages conflict, but one could also imagine that God might have reasons for not making it easy!
EDIT: not so sure about that consistant theme, but that's deep theological fodder, up for endless good natured (and unfortunately non-good natured) debate!
I know there is one God who is all powerful, all knowing, all present and perfect in every way.
He created the Universe and all it contains in 6 literal days (since he created the day he knows how long it is and yes this makes the earth and the entire universe about 6000 years old)
He gave us his word, the Holy Bible and it is infallible and without flaw. Any perceived flaw is a lack of understanding on mans part.
All man can understand and needs to understand about God is written in his Word. All else about God is beyond mans ability to comprehend.
Man is so far below God and as a creation of God has no right to question anything God says or to even know how to please God.
God tells us what is pleasing to him in his Word and only by following what he says is pleasing may we be pleasing to him. All other attempts to please him are sin.
Man was created perfect and walked with God but soon became imperfect by disobeying God.
That which is imperfect (sinful) is separated from God for he is perfect.
Man cannot become perfect again by his own deeds. Once imperfect always imperfect.
Sinfulness required a penalty of death a payment of blood prescribed by God as the only payment for sin.
God emptied himself of deity and came to earth to walk as man among us in the form of Jesus Christ who lived a perfect life without sin in thought or deed.
He served as the perfect sacrifice, through death on a cross, for sin as mankind's representative.
He arose to life again on the third day (the first day of the week, Sunday)
By fulfilling the law as God had given to Moses on the mountain he did away with that law (covenant) and replaced it with a new covenant in which mankind could once again be spiritually perfect through Christ perfect blood sacrifice.
Christ tells us how to accomplish this return to perfection in the New Testament of the Holy Bible so we may once again not be separated from God.
We must hear God's Word.
We must believe God's Word.
We must realize we are imperfect and repent of that imperfection.
Repentance is to change the way we think and act.
We must confess with our lips that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God.
We must be Baptized (that is Immersed in water)
We must continue to live according to Jesus's example found in God's word
Baptism is a transliteration of the word baptismo which means to immerse. It does not mean to sprinkle.
When we are Baptized we are added by God to Christ church, his bride, his possession which carries his name and no name derived by man.
The church of Christ is its members not a building.
You cannot "go to church" but rather the church (those who have been added by God) assembles together on the first day of the week to remember the death, burial and resurrection of Christ through communion by breaking and partaking of unleavened bread (his body that hung on the cross) and new wine, the fruit of the vine (representative of his blood shed for our sins) as he has commanded us to do until his return.
The first century model of the church and those who pattern themselves after it are the only one true church. this is what Christ states in the Bible.
All others are derivations of man and thus false.
Jesus Christ is the only way to the Father and therefore our ONLY intercessor.
This is Truth.
On the final Day every knee will bow and will confess Jesus Christ as Lord of all.
There is a chance to do something about sinfulness while you live but once this life is over so is the chance to be made perfect through the blood of Christ as outlined above and to live in absolute and unending bliss with the Creator.
If that chance is missed then all that is left is punishment for ever and for ever.
Even if you don't agree with these statements (and they will infuriate some of you because no one likes to be told they are wrong) you will remember them on the final Day.
These are not my words or ideas but the words of Jehovah God almighty.
I bring them to you as is commanded me to do by Jesus Christ in God's Holy word and out of love and concern for your eternal soul.
He created the Universe and all it contains in 6 literal days (since he created the day he knows how long it is and yes this makes the earth and the entire universe about 6000 years old)
He gave us his word, the Holy Bible and it is infallible and without flaw. Any perceived flaw is a lack of understanding on mans part.
All man can understand and needs to understand about God is written in his Word. All else about God is beyond mans ability to comprehend.
Man is so far below God and as a creation of God has no right to question anything God says or to even know how to please God.
God tells us what is pleasing to him in his Word and only by following what he says is pleasing may we be pleasing to him. All other attempts to please him are sin.
Man was created perfect and walked with God but soon became imperfect by disobeying God.
That which is imperfect (sinful) is separated from God for he is perfect.
Man cannot become perfect again by his own deeds. Once imperfect always imperfect.
Sinfulness required a penalty of death a payment of blood prescribed by God as the only payment for sin.
God emptied himself of deity and came to earth to walk as man among us in the form of Jesus Christ who lived a perfect life without sin in thought or deed.
He served as the perfect sacrifice, through death on a cross, for sin as mankind's representative.
He arose to life again on the third day (the first day of the week, Sunday)
By fulfilling the law as God had given to Moses on the mountain he did away with that law (covenant) and replaced it with a new covenant in which mankind could once again be spiritually perfect through Christ perfect blood sacrifice.
Christ tells us how to accomplish this return to perfection in the New Testament of the Holy Bible so we may once again not be separated from God.
We must hear God's Word.
We must believe God's Word.
We must realize we are imperfect and repent of that imperfection.
Repentance is to change the way we think and act.
We must confess with our lips that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God.
We must be Baptized (that is Immersed in water)
We must continue to live according to Jesus's example found in God's word
Baptism is a transliteration of the word baptismo which means to immerse. It does not mean to sprinkle.
When we are Baptized we are added by God to Christ church, his bride, his possession which carries his name and no name derived by man.
The church of Christ is its members not a building.
You cannot "go to church" but rather the church (those who have been added by God) assembles together on the first day of the week to remember the death, burial and resurrection of Christ through communion by breaking and partaking of unleavened bread (his body that hung on the cross) and new wine, the fruit of the vine (representative of his blood shed for our sins) as he has commanded us to do until his return.
The first century model of the church and those who pattern themselves after it are the only one true church. this is what Christ states in the Bible.
All others are derivations of man and thus false.
Jesus Christ is the only way to the Father and therefore our ONLY intercessor.
This is Truth.
On the final Day every knee will bow and will confess Jesus Christ as Lord of all.
There is a chance to do something about sinfulness while you live but once this life is over so is the chance to be made perfect through the blood of Christ as outlined above and to live in absolute and unending bliss with the Creator.
If that chance is missed then all that is left is punishment for ever and for ever.
Even if you don't agree with these statements (and they will infuriate some of you because no one likes to be told they are wrong) you will remember them on the final Day.
These are not my words or ideas but the words of Jehovah God almighty.
I bring them to you as is commanded me to do by Jesus Christ in God's Holy word and out of love and concern for your eternal soul.
Well, I can't say you're incorrect. I just don't know. But honestly that is all kind of depressing to me. Having only one approach to the divine/sacred/eternal seems too narrow to me, and if there were a god I would hope he/she/it would program in some more leeway into the world. [Look at quantum physics, talk about "more than one way to do things"!] It doesn't infuriate me though, I think being wrong is a big part of being alive. My thought is that being wrong gives you an opportunity to learn; every time you are correct you are only affirming what you already know. If that Oakland radio preacher guy is right and the world starts to end next week, boy won't I feel wrong then. And I'm ok with that.
I'll admit I'm an atheist in the strict definition (does not believe in a god). [I was raised Catholic.] But I have definitely felt connections to the world around me (specifically about 3 instances in my life) that you could consider "spiritual". The flow of life suggests to me that there is some relationship between all of us (including plants, animals, etc etc). Not quite sure what that connection is, why it is, or if it has a purpose or direction. Personally I kind of like the idea that there is no purpose. Life is free-form, we're here to make our own paths. Every choice we make, every act we perform is shaping the world. There is no destiny, no design, no plan. Everything is sacred. Show me a world where everyone believes that and I think we'd all get along a lot better.
Odd you should use the term "narrow".
Here are the words of Jesus.
Mat 7:13 Go in through the narrow gate. The gate to destruction is wide, and the road that leads there is easy to follow. A lot of people go through that gate.
Mat 7:14 But the gate to life is very narrow. The road that leads there is so hard to follow that only a few people find it.
I wouldn't worry about the end coming next week because no man knows.
Mat 25:13 Therefore, watch, for you do not know the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man comes.
I would love to give you peace and comforting words but they are not mine to give other than to say there is a way out as detailed in my letter above.
Here are the words of Jesus.
Mat 7:13 Go in through the narrow gate. The gate to destruction is wide, and the road that leads there is easy to follow. A lot of people go through that gate.
Mat 7:14 But the gate to life is very narrow. The road that leads there is so hard to follow that only a few people find it.
I wouldn't worry about the end coming next week because no man knows.
Mat 25:13 Therefore, watch, for you do not know the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man comes.
I would love to give you peace and comforting words but they are not mine to give other than to say there is a way out as detailed in my letter above.
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Thank you for your concern, Mesquite.
Unfortunately (for me, perhaps, guess I'll find out at the end of it all, or maybe not even then), I can't bring myself to believe that there is only one true way. I'm not the least bit infuriated that you believe there is but one way, but we'll have to agree to disagree.
I think as long as we can all respect each other's beliefs, the world will be a much better place...
Not that this was necessarily implied by this post, but I would just like to clarify in case there is any confusion, that many of these are not the beliefs helf by Jehovah's witnesses. It is good, though, to hear that someone else recognizes that the Bible does state his name.
Some years ago I read an interesting book on the whole fundamentalist thing, from the perspective of Islamic, Jewish and Christian faiths, and though the specific details are pretty foggy (I only read it once and I don't retain details the way I did in my youth)... but the gist was that many people have been so unsettled at the way the world has been unfolding that out of fear, they've thrown out all the newer religious beliefs and started over, gone right back to basics, taking the appropriate religious writings as a starting point, and coming up with often ultra-conservative (by today's standards) versions of their religion. I don't know about the Q'ran or the Torah but some of the Old Testament stuff I remember from school is pretty "angry vengeful God and not happy loving God", as one of my pagan friends puts it... so it wouldn't surprise me that this comes out in some of the fundamentalist movements if they start taking everything literally, that (and the fear, fear often begets anger) might be where all the anger comes from... that's my $.02 anyway.
No argument there. Have you seen the billboards proclaiming "the end" on May 21? At work we're going to have a nice lunch on Friday to celebrate. I'm sure we'll all be in the following Monday though.
The narrowness still bugs me though. We can all pretty much agree on the basics, and all the religions have a lot of common ground: play nice with others, respect the world around you, give back. Wrapping it up in a complex structure tends to hide the fundamental messages, IMO.
I do like the "the church is the people, not the building" message though. I think community is the best thing religion has going for it.
